Author Topic: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign  (Read 31579 times)

Offline Thalia

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #30 on: February 20, 2006, 02:40:06 PM »
Oh, I firmly believe that jealousy is natural, impossible to counteract, and oftentimes beneficial...

...however, the rule is NOT about preventing jealousy, but about preventing the un-Gorean effects of jealousy when they are applied to an online situation.

Were slaves jealous of other slaves?  Oh, goodness, yes -- and such jealousies often made them better slaves when they competed to catch a desireable man's eye.  However, they did not dare dictate which slave a man should to take to his furs.  To do so would be to encourage a severe beating.  If she lost the "competition," that was the end of it.  In at least one instance in the books, a slave was sold for so much as daring to suggest that a Master should have chosen her to adorn his leash, rather than the slave to which the leash was clipped.

Were slaves jealous of free women?  Oh, goodness, yes -- and they knew they'd better tiptoe around such powerful, wrathful, vain, and prudish women, lest their lives be made a living hell.  The books tell us that slaves almost always hid their sexual needs when in the presence of free women, even if this meant failing to catch the eye of a desireable man. And you'd better believe that a slave had to know a Master extremely well before she could dare to joke about the petty mood swings and prudish ways of free women.

Were free women jealous of other free women and slaves?  Again, absolutely.  Free women sometimes took great pleasure in humiliating the women in their social circle, especially if those other women were extremely beautiful and highly sought for Companionship.  It goes without saying that a free-born woman was incredibly cruel to the female slaves of her household, especially if those female slaves were couch-warmers for her Companion.  And yet the free woman of Gor usually knew better than to shrewishly forbid their Companions to make a journey to the local paga tavern or bath house.  Several times in the books, free women who attempted to interfere in a man's sexual festivities were beaten.

In all of these instances, the jealous women knew better than to dictate to a man where he would take his pleasure.  Regardless of her feelings, the choice was his, which was his right as a man on Gor.

And now we come to online, with its whispers of "don't serve him too sexually, he's already taken," and "I think you need to back away from my man."  You see, most of the jealousies are ALREADY being taken to pm and ruining role-play.  If you haven't seen it IN role-play, that's a good thing -- but that doesn't mean that IMs and PMs haven't been flying left and right.

Yes, jealousy is a human emotion, and Goreans are humans... but the RESULT, the BY-PRODUCT of this ONLINE jealousy is the very UN-Gorean phenomenon of seeking to a control a man's sexuality -- and that is what prompted the rule.

Living in the land of sun, sand, and Thassa breezes, where the only rule is common sense.  What's not to love?

Offline Thalia

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #31 on: February 20, 2006, 02:53:08 PM »
I have re-phrased the law for a more clear-cut interpretation, as follows:

No free woman will seek to "own" or control the attentions of a Gorean man. Yes, jealousy is a natural human emotion -- but Gorean women knew better than to try to dictate a man's sexual exploits. If you have been guilty of warning a free woman or a slave against paying too much attention to "your" man, or if you have "advised" her that a certain man is "taken" because he already has a slave/Intended/Companion, you are out of line. While you may even mean well, it is none of your business. The Ubar has stated that this is "pure bullshit," and that he had better never catch someone doing this. (The obvious but highly unlikely exception would be if you have concrete proof that a Companioned man is consorting with a free woman other than his Companion -- and that would be a matter to bring directly to our Ubar or a Council Member.)

Living in the land of sun, sand, and Thassa breezes, where the only rule is common sense.  What's not to love?

Offline Sati

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #32 on: February 20, 2006, 07:28:46 PM »
Of course I absolutely agree with most of what is being said..but I do NOT understand the need to hide such jealousies..why would we..why would we not openly show our jealousies in active roleplay ..it just doesnt make sense to me...how is a jealous woman to react in rp ? and when told it is unexceptable that is when it goes into pms and ruins shit...it just seems like a nealry impossible rule to follow ..in fact..it would help Me greatly for you to do a pseudo rp here for everyone to see..lets say..Ummm I am companioned to JOE BLOW and he is seeking you out sexually every night and I am jealous as hell....yeah lets see how that should be handled without breaking the rules -winks-
Sati

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Offline Taryn

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #33 on: February 20, 2006, 08:27:23 PM »
there's already a law in place about pm's or going to messengers with gossip..

Offline kadi{MTC}

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #34 on: February 20, 2006, 11:58:17 PM »
ok kadi gonna put here what she thinks is ment by this post


say my Master is in camp and kadi is running round doing things for Him, then along comes kels batting her baby blues at my Master, and He in turn is feeling her up, am i gonna jealous, yes a little cos i wanna be the one in His lap, am i gonna pm kels and tell her to get to f**k away from my Master, hell NO, this is what Ubar and others are saying the pming of slaves and FW telling T/them not to go near this Master/Mistress is not allowed.

Thanks kels for your help in this hugs her heart sis

kadi
May love and laughter light your days..And warm your heart and home..May good and faithful friends be yours..Wherever you may roam..May peace and joy bless your world.. And may all life's passing seasons..Bring the best to you and yours..

Offline Thalia

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #35 on: February 21, 2006, 05:02:30 PM »
~grinning~

Well, Mistress, you'd give me the evil booger-eye, and I'd fall half-dead down on my face with fear... and then stick my tongue out at you behind your back after you'd gotten done kicking me... And THEN I wouldn't tell Master JOE BLOW what a b*tch his woman is, 'cause I'd be beaten dead for that, and you'd tell him what a horrible slave I was but not dare to tell him where to stick his willy, and then we'd have a great time laughing in pm about it...

~snickering~

But seriously, the rule applies to the ooc pms that were flying back and forth, where F/female A told F/female B in IM/PM, "You must not talk/flirt/sexily serve Man A, he has a female in his life," instead of taking the issue out in the open (valid by-the-books role-play) or letting Man A deal with his own sex life (butting out and leaving ooc at the door).  Unfortunately, in not one single instance was the jealousy issue actually role-played or limited to ic interaction.  It was ALL ooc crap, with the Earthen mentality of expecting a girlfriend/boyfriend-style manogamous relationship.  (In fact, I think that's a better way to phrase it on the rule post... I'll ammend asap!)

And we do already have a PMing/IMing rules, but they specifically apply to messaging without permission and to spreading "did you hear what so-and-so did?" type of gossip. 

Other than the above clarifications, I think Master Ubar will have to shed further light if there are still interpretational ambiguities... I do know what he had Mistress Yaya write and post, and that he approved it, and that such was to go on the Rules pages as a seperate and valid issue... but as far as the more in-depth, situation-by-situation application of the law, I have to say I'm not 100% qualified to answer all situations...

« Last Edit: February 21, 2006, 09:30:15 PM by ~ delilah ~ {K} »

Living in the land of sun, sand, and Thassa breezes, where the only rule is common sense.  What's not to love?

Offline Thalia

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #36 on: February 21, 2006, 05:21:49 PM »
Perhaps this is better?

"No free woman will seek to hold a Gorean man to the Earthen concept of a manogamous sexual relationship. Yes, jealousy is a natural human emotion -- but Gorean women knew better than to try to dictate a man's sexual exploits. If you have been guilty of warning a free woman or a slave against paying too much attention to "your" man, or if you have "advised" her that a certain man is "taken" because he already has a slave/Intended/Companion, you are out of line. While you may even mean well, it is none of your business. The Ubar has stated that this is "pure bullshit," and that he had better never catch someone doing this. In other words, leave your Earthen ideals of girlfriend/boyfriend-style relationships at the door. (The obvious but highly unlikely exception would be if you have concrete proof that a Companioned man is consorting with a free woman other than his Companion -- and that would be a matter to bring directly to our Ubar or a Council Member.)"

Any further changes or contingencies would have to come from Master Ubar himself...

And I do think some line should be drawn between valid rp and ooc sniping, somehow... but the text will need to come from a higher authority...
« Last Edit: February 21, 2006, 09:30:30 PM by ~ delilah ~ {K} »

Living in the land of sun, sand, and Thassa breezes, where the only rule is common sense.  What's not to love?

Offline Sati

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #37 on: February 21, 2006, 05:36:47 PM »
-BIG FAT SMOOCH-

I get it now..thanks dee !
Sati

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Offline Coreign

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #38 on: February 28, 2006, 08:18:54 PM »
*inscribes her name*

Coreign

Offline cat{MTC}

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #39 on: March 01, 2006, 01:12:04 PM »
you know  took cat some time to not step back when a sister showed interest in a Master..cat usually would step back and avoid the Master..
to so not hurt this sister or that..
took cat sometime to get the point..
that in Gor  ONLY Ones that matter are the Free
we slave are here to please THEM ALL
we not here to be pleased
so if a Master Blowmenow want deep His cookie in many flavours of deeps  ..well who are we slaves to say He can't or He could?
if a Master is happy..then we should be happy as well..
as means our home is giving the Free exactely what Gor is about
put a Free before us slaves..
i know i know cat make not sense in her writing but ..well wished to say what cat think of it..
and this is to dee ..giggles swats her and then send  :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*

Offline Mae

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #40 on: March 04, 2006, 09:25:35 AM »
nods  with  agreement to  all of the posts

kelsey

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #41 on: March 08, 2006, 04:59:28 AM »
dee....your post goes for slaves as well as FW...I think you need to amend the bold part of your line to say that...oh...and it's spell monogamus, I think...as in mono meaning one

Offline ice{LM/TD}

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2006, 12:30:53 PM »
whispers... "monogamous"
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kelsey

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2006, 01:49:00 PM »
thanks ice...*huggles*

Offline sarienna{MTC}

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Re: Jealousy, both FW and slaves: Please read and sign
« Reply #44 on: March 17, 2006, 02:27:48 AM »
If i'm getting out of hand let me know

Jealousy is a big issue upon gor,but slaves did feel it. After all they do have feelings even if they are considered an animal in gorean law. So slaves will feel it but need to keep it in check,because things could go from bad to worse.

anyhow i'll shut up and i have read n understands